Posted by FLVol on November 6, 2007 at 9:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

oh boy..this reeks

Posted by CrankE on November 6, 2007 at 9:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What broken window?, what arguing? I don't know anything about that, officer. Oh, glad to see you Mr. Harrison. How'd you get here so fast? Sigh.

I guess it's fair to say that McNeil doesn't control his own destiny at this point.

Posted by GreerVol22 on November 6, 2007 at 9:46 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Its at this point the university should tell McNeil your freedom is over. Pack you shi+ and move on campus in the athletic dorms. Were paying for you to go to school, play by our rules or lose the scholarship. The choice is yours bucko!
on the other hand.....

Man! Three? Not impressed by the stupidity but three?

Posted by juicetke on November 6, 2007 at 9:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Does he borrow Smokey's pimp suit?

Posted by drmike on November 6, 2007 at 9:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)

thank god , phil is our disciplinarian. lord knows we need josh on the field. my recommendation is to suspend him from 2, maybe 3, practices. that'll teach him a lesson. as far as arkansas goes, without josh, we'd be lost(kinda rhymes, huh?). go phil, we need josh for the ark. game-make the right decision & let him play!

Posted by JohnyLobo34 on November 6, 2007 at 9:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What's with the cops in Knoxville? don't they recognize the constitution? You can't enter an apartment without a warrant? And what about the University? What is this: The Soviet Republic of UT? I feel sorry for those kids; they can't sneeze up there without having some cop, apt. mgr,or university official all over them. Do you guys just make up the laws as you go in Tennessee?

Posted by drmike on November 6, 2007 at 9:56 a.m. (Suggest removal)

let him play (like he does in the bedroom), phil, let him play!!!

Posted by Feared_Mustang_Package on November 6, 2007 at 9:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)

You're all missing the biggest point of the story. 3 women in his bed. That sir deserves a hat tip.

Posted by Feared_Mustang_Package on November 6, 2007 at 10:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Also, underage college kids drinking???? No!!!! What has this world come to.

Posted by 10ACVOL on November 6, 2007 at 10:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)

HA! THey found blood by the broken window and his arms were bleeding, "What broken window?" Obviously he was drunk

Posted by glbftb on November 6, 2007 at 10:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Mississippi Bubba!!

Posted by DennisVols on November 6, 2007 at 10:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)

This is just another continuing sign of this programs lack of discipline. Since the '2000 season this football program has had one case after another of players making bad decisions off the field. Multiple assrests and supensions due to drugs & alcohol. This lack of discipline off the field also shows up during the games on the field. The lack of respect for the university and the coaching staff is why we get blown out in the big games.
Here we are again with the opportunity to win the SEC east and the big stories the last couple of weeks are all focused on players making bad decisions off the field.
Who is in control of this team?

Posted by eschroeder on November 6, 2007 at 10:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)

How often does an offensive lineman get to score?

Posted by surfmaster on November 6, 2007 at 10:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)

"several rifles, shotguns and a handgun, but no one greeted them" ??? Is south knoxville getting that dangerous? One recipe for disaster: Ingredients - 2 rifles, 2 shotguns, 1 handgun, 3 drunk women, 1 drunk offensive lineman, 4 pints of alcohol, 1 pint visible blood, 4 tempers flaring. Stir pot until comes to a boil.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 10:15 a.m.

(This comment was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by DenmarkVol_aka_Mbumburu on November 6, 2007 at 10:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Another Tennessee legend is born.

Posted by volunteerTY23 on November 6, 2007 at 10:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)

go josh it's your birthday........good to know he can handle a tripple team all by himself....

Posted by 55Vol on November 6, 2007 at 10:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

trap2240...don't hold your breath waiting for the daughter...a classless remark from a Comedy Central wannabe. Classless....

Posted by LazhilUT on November 6, 2007 at 10:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

He has guns, a broken window, bleeding cuts...citations in the past...Time to go kid! See ya! Don't let the door hit your butt on the way out! Bye bye!
Oh wait, he will get more chances, after all he's caucasian, while african american athletes get less chances than the white ones at UT. This coming from a caucasian male.
Brent Schaeffer got the boot after one incident, the rednecks still didn't want an African American QB at UT. I bet some of them still can't believe that an African American QB took UT to the National Championship.
UT is racist and this kid will walk away freely while he def did somethign wrong, did not cooperate with cops and had a freakin' army of guns at his apartment. Don't tell me he was going hunting...

Posted by volunteerTY23 on November 6, 2007 at 10:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)

lazhilutdelt, that is the dumbest thing i've ever heard anyone say....yes i'm african american and yes i think your an idiot, lamarcus coker too many chances, james banks too many chances, ontario smith too many chances, major wingate too many chances I can go on and on.....you make no since stupid comment and really should be removed.

Posted by orangebloodgmc on November 6, 2007 at 10:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Um, Laz, Coker is not Caucasian ... you think he should have gotten MORE chances?

Posted by DSaVol on November 6, 2007 at 10:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Ah c'mon guys! Ole Josh was just practicin' his "shotgun snaps" an' gettin' his legs back!

Posted by LazhilUT on November 6, 2007 at 10:33 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I'm not saying that Banks, Smith, Coker should have gotten more chances but look at the high number of chances and incidents that the white players get away with while the african american players get the shaft much quicker than the white players.
And not I did not say that Coker is caucasian, if it came out that way sorry but I do know he's an african american athlete. I saw him actually on Saturday in a car outside Andy Holt apartments.
But how can you guys explain Schaeffer being kicked out of the university after ONE incident?

Posted by FWBVol on November 6, 2007 at 10:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I'm not as concerned about McNeil and the weapons as I am the three drunk women, broken window and his not cooperating with the police.

McNeil likes to hunt, and living off campus, has every right to own and keep the firearms. Nowhere in the story does it say the weapons were illegal. In fact, I wonder what the mention of the weapons really has to do with the story.

A couple of generations ago students and athletes that hunted had guns and bows on campus so they could get in the woods on those rare occassions.

Fans, not only at UT, but across the country, are upset about the lack of control coaches have over athletes. I say it's time to place the blame where it belongs...on the NCAA. An athletic staff can only do so much monitoring a group of athletes when they are spread out all over Knoxville or any other college town.

Bring back the athletic dorm. The NCAA can shout all it wants to about letting the student/athlete have a typical college experience, but that's a bunch of garbage. Whether they live in an athletic dorm, some other dorm on campus or off campus, an athlete will never have a typical or normal student experience.

Coaches can better control players when they are living in the same location. Another advantage of having players live in the same location is the leaders on a team can be there to see what is happening and maybe use a little more peer influence.

I hope Phillip Fulmer takes the appropriate action with McNeil. As for now though he hasn't been charged with anything by the police. If stupidity was a crime though, they have enough for a felony in this case.

Posted by Orange4life on November 6, 2007 at 10:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Man people never seem to amaze me. This has nothing to do with race. Banks, Smith, Coker all where givin several oppurtunities to many in my book. To call my university racist? Come on. Underage drinking ok where does it not take place in college? Gimmie a break people

Posted by birminghamvol on November 6, 2007 at 10:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Schaeffer wasn't kicked off after "one incident" you freaking idiot. It was multiple incidents that included the fight and the grade infractions. Only a real idiot would bring race into this. Add Daniel "D-Block" Brooks to the list of AA's who got WAY more than their fair share of chances. The real decider when it comes to # of chances with this pitiful staff is how big a star they are (or how many Scout stars they had). If this was a second string long snapper or a freshman 1 star WR .. he would have been tossed last night. Get a clue Lazhil … educate yourself beyond your obvious 1st grade level of stupidity and mix in a little common sense and critical thinking ability.

Posted by burntorangeVOLffle on November 6, 2007 at 10:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Laz - UT had the first African American QB in the SEC ever. And Tony Robinson was as popular as Peyton Manning in his day.

Schaffer had other issues before the fight that got him dismissed. And Coker, an African American, got every chance the guidelines allowed before being cut loose. James Banks also got multiple chances.

Save your moronic comments for Alabama whom I don't recall ever having an AA QB.

Posted by MOOREVOLS on November 6, 2007 at 10:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

trap2240, classless, without question.

LazhilUTDelt, you're wrong. Looks like you may be the racist. Isn't coker black? He had as many chances as anyone ever gets at Tennessee and I don't ever remember anyone ever being upset that Tee Martin or Brent Schaeffer were QB's at Tennessee. In fact, alot of people were unhappy or sad to see Schaeffer leave, although most people understood that he had to go since he had 3 or 4 chances after problems himself. lazhilUTdelt, you're so far off base it's pathetic. It's people like you that stirr up trouble or problems when there's nothing there. There's no reason at all for your post. You need to keep your ridiculous comments to yourself. If there's one thing our coaches are, it's fair. They're fair to everyone, regarless of race. They may not be the best "football" coaches, but without question they do not ever us race as a factor in a decision.

Posted by lempga on November 6, 2007 at 10:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Go Josh! Three at once! I admire you. Josh THE STUD.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 10:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

If you knew what I knew you would know i wasn't kidding...it was a real question

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 10:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)

So far it sounds like some drunk girls were sleeping it off at Josh's apartment and wouldn't let him in so he got ticked off and smashed a window.

Doesn't show alot of self-control but there isn't anything YET to suggest most of the stuff you guys have assumed. The article didn't say they were naked or suggest that he'd slept with them. The article didn't say that he was drunk or cited for drinking. He may have been but the article seems to be pretty detailed about other facts like the fact that the girls were drunk and charged.... to include their names.

If I had to guess, I'd say he lied about breaking the window and was arguing with the girl about locking him out... but we'll see as the story unfolds. If he lied, he better hurry and amend his statement.

Posted by MOOREVOLS on November 6, 2007 at 10:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)

trapp2240 -- Still classless. Why bring anything like that up. No reason for it. His daughter isn't even part of the story. Pitiful.

Posted by Basketball_Jones on November 6, 2007 at 10:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Lobo you don't need a warrant if their is probable cause. If the police are called and they have reason to believe something illegal or bad is going on (blood on the window) then they have the right to enter the building. As far as UT being racist, I have always thought the same thing. I tried to say they were racist in the late 80's when I was offered a football scholarship, had to be because I was white 5'8" and weighed 160lbs. UT racist? Whatever

Posted by GreerVol22 on November 6, 2007 at 10:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)

VolCR, I'll bet the arrow on his chart is pointing down today...contrary to last night...

by the way, the Knoxville Task Force on Flower Pot Terrorism seems to be tax money well spent. Who knows how many flower pots Josh could have shot if not apprehended.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 10:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

trap2240, It doesn't matter if you were kidding or not. Rumormongering is still classless.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 10:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)

so it was a classless shot...sue me

Posted by vol4jesus on November 6, 2007 at 10:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I believe Alabama did have a Black Qb when Dubose or Stallings coached. Still race card in this matter has no connection. Hope this yungin gets the message. I do wish they still had athletic dorm for better control. Political correcters said was not fair to non-athletes. Oh well the elite police won that one. TRAP2240 GET A LIFE AND CLEAN UP YOUR TRASHY MIND!!! Greervol22 said it...CLASSLESS!!! Sounds like you need more help than McNeil in this one.

Posted by utvols18 on November 6, 2007 at 10:56 a.m. (Suggest removal)

This is ridiculous. This is just one of the instances involving these players that has come to light. I for one agree...what the hell are they doing allowed to live off campus if they can't be responsible. Is it not our money that pays their rent? I'm all for a little fun, but when you are privileged to be a member of the team you have a responsibility to live up to. Anyone on campus knows that the majority of the players party,drink etc. Surely the coaching staff knows as well. Possibly one of the reasons the team is so unfocused on the field is because they are concentrating on the after game partying.
Shameful.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 10:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)

why's that? so i said a "rumormongering" statement about a 21 year old female. how's that worse then lying to the police and having three drunk underage girls in my bed?

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 10:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Sergeant Schultz (From Hogan's Heroes): "I see nothing! NOTHING!"

Alfred E. Neumann (Mad Magazine): "What. Me worry?"

Guess who: "At the University of Tennessee we take these issues seriously."

Posted by hiresanders on November 6, 2007 at 11:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What a renegade program this is. How in the world are staying off probation??

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 11:03 a.m. (Suggest removal)

"Citing that McNeil was not arrested in the incident, Tiffany Carpenter, UT athletic department public relations director, said UT is not planning any disciplinary measures against McNeil and head coach Phillip Fulmer has no formal comment on it."

Strong message. Everything is fine. Pay no attention to the minor details of the facts.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 11:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I wonder when the NCAA "Get out of probation free card" expires. I know, I know. That's negative. Sadly, so is this latest episode of "Vols gone wild." Couldn't that become a video?

Who's in control? Nobody.

Posted by KingsportVol on November 6, 2007 at 11:13 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Good game Big Bad Booty Daddy!!!

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 11:16 a.m. (Suggest removal)

"why's that? so i said a "rumormongering" statement about a 21 year old female. how's that worse then lying to the police and having three drunk underage girls in my bed?"

trap2240, Because that particular 21 year old female isn't guilty of anything and has no means of defending herself... and as best we know has given you absolutely no reason to run her down in a public forum.

What does McNeil's deed have to do with justifying your attack on some third party regardless of whether what you are doing is "worse" or not? Answer: NOTHING.

You made a classless statement. If your man enough to say, "Oh, that was classless, sorry"... then it might be just a mistake. If you really have the "sue me" attitude... then you are probably just an immature and classless person.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 11:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

hiresanders, Please cite the NCAA reg that suggests that UT has done anything wrong in this case at this point.

They followed the policy that has NCAA approval with Coker, Fellows, Morley, etc... What is it precisely that they've done that makes you think they should be on probation?

Posted by VOLstuckINky on November 6, 2007 at 11:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)

At least it wasn't the night before the "big" game ... Put it in the chronicles of what UT football has become.

Posted by mloaks on November 6, 2007 at 11:26 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Sounds like a privacy issue re consenting adults to me.

Posted by bmgvirgo on November 6, 2007 at 11:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Ok, I am still trying to figure out exactly why is this newsworthy? Is it because he bedded 3 women or what???? He wasn't charged with a crime, which is a shock since KPD seems to love doing that to UT athletes any chance they get. Why print it? If he is charged with a crime or is suspended then so be it, but otherwise please only publish the news and not stuff for a tabloid.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 11:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)

vol4jesus-"it sounds like you need more help than mcneil on this one"...

He said what I did was worse than josh mcneil. Thats why my comment and his situation was compared. About that third party...which of mcneil's playmates were you reffering to?

Posted by yemmusdarb on November 6, 2007 at 11:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Sounds like those cops were drinking heavy amounts of Hatorade. It's hard out here for a player! Huh Josh?

I've been in more than a few altercations with police on campus, as far as parties/drinking underage. Normally they are pretty cool, but it sounds like these douche bags are just mad that 3 girls would choose to be in a bed with a future NFL player and not the bed of a complete failure in life with a wife beater mustache on a power trip.

Posted by VOLstuckINky on November 6, 2007 at 11:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)

said it last year ... say it again .. UT cops are good for keys locked in cars and cats in trees. Don't trust em'.

Posted by VolSwaff on November 6, 2007 at 11:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)

fulmer kicked nilo silvan from the team for just one underage girl. now Mcneil gets away with 3???

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 11:37 a.m. (Suggest removal)

trap2240, Are you dense in addition to being classless? You mentioned Fulmer's daughter.

Let's review the facts: The article doesn't say McNeil had sex with them or was even sleeping with them. It doesn't say he was drunk or drinking. It doesn't say there was a video camera or anything like that. It doesn't mention Fulmer's daughter who you brought into the conversation.

Your making stuff up about real people that can really hurt their reputation. GROW UP.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 11:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Just out of curiosity, do any of you acting like this is no big deal know what Tennessee Football guidelines are for players and their actions off the field? You think this is no big deal? No wonder it seems like so many keep thinking everything is okay here.

Read this if you haven't:

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colleg...

And why is our program being held more and more in contempt? Because its run like an unsupervised nursery and the "true fans" ignore everything and bleet, "Naaaaaaa. Everythings fine."

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 11:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

For those that I have offended, I apologize.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 11:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

It's the cops fault! That's it! Those morons!

Posted by CrankE on November 6, 2007 at 11:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Honestly officer, I went to sleep looking at my chart, checking off the different blocks on there (I'm trying to make sure I'm in bed on time, working a heckuva lot harder.) and then I just woke up and there were these three drunk, yet totally hot co-eds in my room who had chucked my petunia out the window. The nerve of some girls!!

No, I don't know how they got in. The door was locked wasn't it?
______________________

At least the kid didn't have a dog. Given recent history, KPD might have emptied the mag into Fido and sent him a bill for the bullets.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 11:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Swaff, These girls aren't under the age of consent and there's nothing yet saying he was "with them" in the biblical sense. They are under drinking age.

He may have been. He may not have been. But those details aren't a matter of record yet.

I am a conservative Christian. I haven't drank alcohol in more than 15 years... but the law on the drinking age is downright ridiculous. A girl can choose to have an abortion at virtually any age. A young person can join the military and die for "freedom" at 18. They can get married, drive a car, buy a house, have relations with a dirty old man (or virtually any other variety of sexual deviancy), appear in pornography,... all at 18... but they can't legally buy and drink beer.

That's just plain ol' stupid.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 11:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)

CrankE,

That is priceless!

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 11:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I know none of that was metioned. IT WAS A JOKE...I do know things about her that r facts, have seen with my own 2 eyes. Maybe it was below the belt to bring her up. The video tape thing was a joke...are you dense? Quit being so naive. Do you really think Foolmer cares about what you or I thinks about him? Or what his reputation is to anyone in this forum. He could care less.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 11:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I have a daughter trap... if you ever have a teenage daughter maybe you'll be able to answer that question yourself.

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 11:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)

LazhilUTDelt, come on man....white players get more chances than African American players? Coker failed 4 drug tests, skipped drug counseling sessions and didn't go to class. I don't buy the unequal treatment depending on race argument.

I would be curious however to know how many incidents McNeil has been in. What I will say is this article is VERY descriptive in regards to specifics of the incident....something Coker et al's have not been.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 11:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I have a daughter too. The point is I apologized if I offended you. Take it or leave it alone. I made an off the cuff remark about something that happened in the past. I meant it in a joking manner thinking it would go without much discussion. For the record- Lets hope and pray our daughters have more class.

Posted by todd on November 6, 2007 at 11:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Josh....U R the MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by ThurmondEppy on November 6, 2007 at 11:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Underaged women? They were all over 18 you morons. Therefore, they can sleep with whomever they want. What?? Oh my gosh (gasp)!! There was drinking involved?? Say it isn't so. I guess this board is filled with people who never drank a drop before they turned 21 or who never drank in their lives. Get over your self righteous selves.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 11:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)

True or False? This story gets mcneil more butt this weekend?

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 12:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

tngeoff, very well put...your post made me think. I believe what we have in this scenerio is a delima of what is "morally correct" and what is "legally correct". Given that we do not have access to all of the facts of the case, on the surface it still appears yet another UT player is going against what should be condusive conduct of a University athlete. If we look at this from a moral perspective, I think the question we have to ask (based on the THINK article you posted) did the player break team rules? If so, its a rules infraction and should be handled accordingly. I belive if team rules are broken, then the player should be removed from the team after XX amount of infractions.

If we are looking at this from a legal perspective, then Oneal has broken no laws other than underage drinking. I think the question to ask is DOES IT MATTER the violation that occured, or should the number of incidents be the key? Not a clear cut situation here...very sticky. Unfortunately, its another example of the ongoing troubles that plague kids that think they can get away with it because of who they are.

Zero tolerance??

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 12:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Cut trap2240 some slack here folks. He apologized if he offended anyone, and showed some class by doing so.

If folks want to dish some hell out, focus on players that fail multiple drug screens and throw their football careers in the dumpster.

Posted by Hunter on November 6, 2007 at 12:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The African-American QB at Bama was Andrew Zow, about 6 years ago. One of the best players we ever had for Tennessee, just wearing a Bama uniform! Tee Martin was beloved by UT fans (note the wax statue next to Peyton in the Neyland-Thompson Sports Complex).

If ignorance is bliss, LazhilDelt must be exuberant (look it up - it means really happy).

Posted by letshave1more on November 6, 2007 at 12:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Two of the girls were students at VaTech! I think this smells of Coach Beamers specials teams! :-)

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 12:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The thing that kills me is these guys(tennessee trouble makers) that get into trouble are usually repeat offenders in some form or fashion, whether it be failing multiple drug tests or having multiple academic issues, or having multiple drinking or drug arrests. It's not the whole team, but a few bad apples hurting their teamates as well as themselves. Fulmer needs to try another way of "nipping things in the bud". It's the same few guys putting themselves in bad situations time and time again.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 12:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Schaeffer wasn't kicked out. He got in trouble for one incident, then when another one happened he met with Fulmer and he chose to leave. I would assume that he chose that over a lengthy suspension. I don't know if it was the 1st or 2d incident, but one was for assault/battery of another student.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 12:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The boneheads on this page are off-base on this McNeil thing.
1. It is not illegal to break a window to access your own residence.
2. It is not illegal to own firearms unless you are a felon.
3. It is not illegal to refuse to answer police questions. He was neither charged nor taken into custody.
4. It is not illegal to have 3 women in your bed.

The only wrongdoing here was underage alcohol consumption and the 3 young ladies were cited.

As for the morality police out there, concentrate on your own children. You may disagree with Mr. McNeil's choices in this situation, but it's none of your dam* business.
As many on here love to proclaim, Mr. McNeil is a legal adult. If he lost his keys and needs to break into his own place so he can get it on with 3 willing young ladies, then he is fully within his rights and certainly doesn't merit discipline from his football team.

Posted by trap2240 on November 6, 2007 at 12:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Unless something else comes out, no he shouldn't be disciplined. But, they are covering something up.

Posted by JohnyLobo34 on November 6, 2007 at 12:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I've said it before & I'll say it again: "The constitutional rights of these young men & women are being violated!" A good Southern Lawyer will question the probable cause of entering McNeil's apartment. You could make the same argument in the Duke Crews Mary-Jane incident. Cooperating with police? That's not going to get him anywhere. They're going to use that to hang someone out to dry. McNeil, obviously, learned an important lesson the first time around. The Police in that town and throughout Tennessee, for that matter, have an overinflated sense of their power and responsibility. They bully, intimidate, and run rough-shod over people in the name of the law. I'd be really concerned about due-process for these athletes. Shouldn't you have the freedom to do as you please, for the most part, in the privacy of your home?

Posted by Volnavychief on November 6, 2007 at 12:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This is why our O-line can't knock anyone off the ball.....they're too pooped to pop!! Three...he had three wild, flexible, teenaged young ladies in his bed!!!! Josh, you are da' man!!!!

Posted by MemfrisVOL on November 6, 2007 at 12:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Normally its Defensive Linemen who get double and triple teamed. Nice work Josh.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 12:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Exactly what is it that McNeil has done wrong from a UT football perspective?

Posted by TommyJack on November 6, 2007 at 12:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

LazHillfratboy: Your stupidity continues to astound me. How do you devine that UT fan's have a problem with AfricanAmerican QB? Get a grip man...

Posted by erwmy on November 6, 2007 at 12:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Can someone please help me understand why any of this matters? cjraney is exactly right. JM has not broken a single law, or even a rule, unless it was after curfew. If McNeil's door had been open so he didn't have to break the window, then no noise would have woken the idiot that called the cops. I lived at Woodmeade South in college, and jeez at least one window was broken every Saturday or it was a boring party. At least 15 of us skinny dipped drunk in that pool at the top of the complex every weekend night. And we were all underage and we were all drunk, and for God's sake I graduated with a 3.5 and have a wife and two kids and the world did not come to an end. I wonder if Hacksaw Reynolds was drunk when he sawed that car in half? I wonder if Dale Jones got shi*faced the night after he stole Shula's pass out of the air. I wonder ho wmany women Vols slepth with inNew Orleans in 85 or tempe in 98. You freaking pansies. This is a non story. McNeil just cemented himself in the legend category. He was simply trying to better understand the triple option in case Fulmer asked him to play a little defense.

This is actually one of the funniest things that has happened on the hill in years.

IT IS COLLEGE!!!!!

Now, what's the over/under on chicks in his bed if we win Saturday? I'll say 5.

Posted by agentorange on November 6, 2007 at 12:46 p.m.

(This comment was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by erwmy on November 6, 2007 at 12:57 p.m.

(This comment was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by SmokeDog72 on November 6, 2007 at 1:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)

3 chicks in bed at the same time..........

Sometimes I miss school.

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 1:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

cjraney, I agree with you (and think I made my point with the morality vs legality issue in an earlier post). I think what many people are looking at is how current actions of certain people will effect the future.

What I think is important to do is look at the standards set forth for the players. As we discussed earlier in the week about the Coker issue, he was asked to follow the same standards as the other players on the team. He was given once chance, then two. Then he failed 2 more drug screens and missed counseling sessions in addition to failing to attend class. My thought on that was "What must the other players be thinking watching this"?

I am all for giving chances, but I believe there has to be a point where a person needs to suffer the consequences of their actions. To me, it isn't a morality issue, its a common sense issue. If a person knowingly has a rule infraction and knows he will suffer no consequences, he will be more likely to infract again.

Did Oneal do anything illegal? It doesn't appear that he has. Should he be disciplined by the football team for this action? ONLY if he violated team rules. As to my comment the other day about "it doesn't matter what Coker did" and you asking me if I meant that...this is what I meant....if a student continues to break team rules, over time there MUST be substantial consequences for the action (no matter how small it is). If not, there is no reason to have the rules in the first place.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 1:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Again, what football team rules did McNeil break?

Posted by LazhilUT on November 6, 2007 at 1:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Somebody needs to re-read my post before calling me racist. I said the opposite! I wish we still had Schaeffer instead of Ainge. The incidents that Brent got involved at UT were much less (in number) than Coker did but he got kicked out with less strike outs on his chart. I've heard in the stands UT fans saying that they did not like black QBs TommyJack. I as I said, am white but do believe that unfortunately, racism still exists at UT and in its athletic department. Schaeffer did not get fair treatment from the UT Athletics Department and from the coaching staff.
As for the "moronic" comments, whatever, I was on campus when it all happened and happened to be around Clement Hall a lot when the whole thing with Schaeffer happened and he was unfairly treated.

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 1:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Here is something to think about.....

I hear a lot of folks say that players should be given XXX amount of chances and that people are judgemental and moral police against "kids" for small things. But what if the consequences were much tougher in the beginning? What if Coker would have had SEVERE consequences for his 1st drug offense. I'm not saying kick him off the team for good, but give him HARD consequences...mabye even suspend him for 5 games..or longer?

My point is, was Coker (and many others) serviced an injustice in the long run? If the first offense was harsh, then maybe he doesn't fail another 3 drug tests. Maybe he goes to class and realizes the importance of participation in D-1 football. Maybe he realizes that if he gets caught again the same old slap on the wrist consequences won't occur.

I don't really think you can blame Coker for continuing to mess up. Hell, if I had 3 chances initially then why wouuld I think I wouldn't get a 4th....or 5th..or 6th.

I wish LaMarcus and all the other adults that have left UT well. I hope they can get their lives back together.

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 1:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

jrany,

I don't know....does anyone have a copy of the football teams "team rules"?

Posted by LazhilUT on November 6, 2007 at 1:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Just to stress one thing...I do think the players get way too many chances, one mistake = last chance to stay out of trouble. But I do believe that black players get less chances, specially if they play in high profile positions, ie. Brent Schaeffer.

Posted by KingsportVol on November 6, 2007 at 1:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

As long as the girls weren't related to him he didn't break any team rules.

Posted by orangebloodgmc on November 6, 2007 at 1:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Right, K'vol, this aint Alabama.

Posted by invisiblekid on November 6, 2007 at 1:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Sounds like the THINK card was put to good use on Saturday. First Rule of THINK Card: DENY DENY DENY, Second Rule of THINK Card: DENY DENY DENY, Third Rule of THINK Card: if you are in handcuffs, you must DENY. Harrison deserves a game ball for his actions this week. Another blemish on the off-the-field record for the Vols but at least no one was hurt except for the plant and window.

Seriously, McNeil is probably lucky he didn't get a disturbing the peace citation which could have screwed up the deal on the underage consumption charge. Also lucky that all the weapons checked out(presumably) or this could have gotten real ugly.

Posted by TurboFan on November 6, 2007 at 1:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BurntOrange, have you ever heard of Condredge Holloway or Jimmy Streater? They preceded Tony Robinson.

Not a lawyer, but the police had probable cause to enter the premises based on the complaint and the broken window. Although, unless the girls volunteered that they were underage and had been drinking, or had alcohol on them, can't see how they could be arrested being as they were on private property.

Apparent that Josh was not drinking and no alcohol was on the premises otherwise would have violated his terms.

Lastly, the only things these girls are guilty of is underage drinking and going to somebody's apartment. No one on this board knows who did what with whom or how many times. Let's stop sullying the reputations of semi-innocent people.

Posted by GoVol on November 6, 2007 at 1:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

LazHil - I totally disagree with your statement that blacks get fewer chances than the white players when it comes to infractions. Where's your facts/proof?

You keep citing the Brent Schaffer situation and he got exactly what he deserved. He had plenty of opportunities.

So, you are going to make such a general racial comment with what appears to be with one student/athlete - Brent Schaffer?

Your comments are pure STUPID!!!!!

Posted by sandboxpup on November 6, 2007 at 1:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Never let the facts get in the way of a good story!!

I, also, would like to know what Josh McNeil has done wrong. If it's a crime to be in the vicinity of drunk 18-19 year olds, they'd have to arrest the entire student section.

Posted by GoVol on November 6, 2007 at 1:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Go Josh - be sure to save some energy for the game though. Brings back the good 'ole college time memories.

Posted by BahamaVol on November 6, 2007 at 1:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

erwmy...AMEN BRUTHA!!! I know that I had at least every window at my woodmeade south apartment replaced...and somehow, I am still a productive member of society. We don't need any distractions...just let the dude have his 3somes, and keep on protecting Ainge. GO VOLS, and GO McNeil...as long as it is not my sister.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 1:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc-ash,
So Coker may have suffered an injustice at the hands of UT's disciplinary system?

I'll reserve judgment, but that sounds a lot like the "liberal BS" label you were accusing others of in your previous posts.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 1:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash,

Good points. Through all the nutty ramblings posted here, there is a real problem. We have had so many problems with football players and Coach Fulmer has stressed that he wants it stopped repeatedly. This "incident" (which it is an incident) couldn't come at a worse time for Coach Fulmer and the attempts he claims to be making to change the image of an "out of control program." So while many "cheer McNeil's manhood" and make bizarre and paranoid ramblings about the police, it was an idiotic thing for a football player to be caught up in with all that has gone on. No excuses. PERIOD.

To all: There doesn't have to be an NCAA violation per se for the NCAA to begin to scrutinize a program. This continued stupidity can very esily bring problems that are of dire consequences to Tennessee football. Now, if that's funny and that makes McNeil "a man's man", then hey, enjoy the laugh. At some point in time, the bill for all these antics will come due. No doubt about that.

Mike Hamilton...I hope you're getting a good chuckle too. It all reflects on your tenure and it makes you look like a fool as well.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 1:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)

More info has been added to the story in case someone hasn't noticed.

It sounds like the girls were passed out and McNeil got ticked off because they wouldn't let him in so he broke a window... pretty close to what I posted earlier FTR.

Like I suggested, he's now amended his statement to admit he broke the window.

Look's like much ado over nothing. Any non-athlete student could have had something similar happen and it would have never even made the campus paper.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 1:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Maybe that's what we need to wake up. The NCAA sending a team down here to closely scrutinize our program.

NCAA Corporate Offices: Ring, ring. "Hello, this is Coach Saban...and I have some information..."

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 1:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)

tngeoff and all,

Does someone have proof that McNeil was being a "man" with all three of these girls? His explanation sounds much more reasonable than that.

Posted by iam4ua on November 6, 2007 at 1:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Just another UT thug in a long, long line of lunatics at UT. The inmates definitely run that asylum. UT has produced about every type of known criminal. UT can boast of two murderers in Goodrich and Little.
This is nothing but pure Karma. Fillup Fulmer cannot win on a level playing field so he and the UT brass decide to setup their arch enemy. Now, Foolmer is getting "owned" yet again but Bama and the UT brass cannot afford to fire him because he knows so many dirty secrets.
Josh McNeil is just another ut player(an avg one at that) that was given a license to "do what the hell he wants" when he signed at UT. I am pretty sure he has a debit card to the slush fund. Wonder if Tee Martin still "taps dat"?
Good luck with your nightmare.
41-17
ROLL TIDE ROLL!
MOX

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 1:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)

geoff, do you think Saban is going to make that call at this point? I don't think so.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 1:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Somebody post the team guidelines for football players. If this isn't a breach, I'd be very surprised. Also, let's get Mike Hamilton's "spin" on it. I'm sure he's laughing too. It's soooo funny.

Posted by sandboxpup on November 6, 2007 at 1:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Geoff -

Do you have proof to dispute McNeil's argument that two of the girls were sleeping in the floor? If not, what is he guilty of? Having a neighbor call the police because they heard a pot break? Should Fulmer issue a new rule that, in case you forget your keys, any use of a potted plant to gain entry to your residence must be in accordance with the law?

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 1:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

iam4ua, Don't let the facts get in your way.

The facts as they are known are currently listed in this article. McNeil was locked out. His drunk girlfriend and two female friends were asleep on his bed so he busted out the window to get in.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 1:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

sjt18,

I'm just relating to the people posting. I could care less if he was being a man and didn't relate it from the story. He was making mistakes and that's all I'm concerned about.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 1:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Posted by sjt18

geoff, do you think Saban is going to make that call at this point? I don't think so.

No. It's just a point to try to accentuate the potential seriousness that all these events can lead to.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 2 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Geoff, what specifically did McNeil do that you would like to have made against the rules? Is he now to be responsible for what his girlfriend and her friends do? Is he supposed to put them on the road back to their place even if they're drunk? Do you want a rule that no UT athlete can date someone who might drink underage, get a speeding ticket, et al?

The guy had friends passed out on his bed. He was locked out and eventually broke a window to get in. We don't really know much more than that. They could have locked him out after an argument... it has happened to alot of people. He could have gone somewhere and simply forgotten his keys... that's happened too.

It really shows where people's minds and hearts are when they make some of the conjectures folks have here today.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

sandboxpup,

My entire point is that this is less a legal issue than a team rules issue. No matter how this whole thing went down, he didn't follow even the guidelines that Fulmer listed in the '05 article from the Sporting News and others since. It may sound funny to some, but it is a problem if he failed, after all that has gone on, to follow protocol.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 2:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Geoff, what mistakes are you referring to?

Posted by GoVol on November 6, 2007 at 2:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

On another topic - ESPN today has Georgia winning the SEC East and going to the Sugar Bowl. They have UT at the Music City bowl against FLA State.

They predict Ohio St. against LSU in the BCS Champ. game.

Posted by drmike on November 6, 2007 at 2:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

stop the rascist crap. there is no rascism. you're trying to stir the kettle black. i have many black friends & we'll be friends 4ever. whomever is posting the rascist crap, pee off. get a real life. i have many african american friends and race is never an issue--even though they are always in the minority. PEACE!!!!

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Simly put, ""He refused to cooperate," DeBusk said of McNeil."

What is this mumbo jumbo for?

From Ray Glier, coliumn in 2005 for USA TODAY

KNOXVILLE, Tenn. — Before University of Tennessee football players get a playbook, they get a Think Card. It is an orange card small enough to fit into their wallets. On the front it says, "THINK," followed by a series of questions designed to help the player assess his behavior and make the appropriate decision.

"It's embarrassing to our administration, to our fans, to our coaches, to me and to a large portion of the other kids," coach Phillip Fulmer said of the recent arrests.
By Ed Reinke, AP

On the back of the card are the home and cell phone numbers of the Tennessee coaching staff so players can call for help.

The Think Card is part of a safety net of counselors, tutors and role models the university has been constructing since 1995 after eight football players had run-ins with the law in a one-year span.

Posted by Pullingguard on November 6, 2007 at 2:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You goons make my head swoon, you take this ant hill and make a mountain out of it.. There has been enough print here to convict someone of a crime. The man is trying to forget another swoon by the football team and not think about the upcoming blow-out and what happens.. his privacy is invaved, his women have their names posted, he is handcuffed in his own bedroom, and you have a bunch of the natives going bananas throwing shovels of fuel on this small bon-fire.. It's worse than a bunch of groupies chasing princess Diana. Take a break or a nap or just go away and for closers. ESPN does not know crap about anything.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"He refused to cooperate" That alone is outside the scope of all the Fulmer gimmicks designed to deflect attention from football problems with players. The entire scenario is bad, but instead of using the methods he was told to use, "He refused to cooperate." with the police. If you refuse to cooperate, something isn't exactly right. We may never know all the details, but you're fooling yourself if you think this is "no big deal." It is another in an ongoing series of stupid decisions by football players.

Posted by FWBVol on November 6, 2007 at 2:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

iam4ua, who did you get to read the story to you, an Auburn grad? Do you have any textbooks you need? I understand you can get the Crimson Tide discount if you know the right player?

McNeil is so average that he was the top rated center prospect in the country coming out of high school and he was on the All-SEC freshman team last year too.

Phillip Fulmer does win on a level playing field. It's the Tide that has rolled up the cheating through the years. The only thing Alabama knows about a clean program is they haven't had one in years.

Posted by TurboFan on November 6, 2007 at 2:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I hope all you juveniles that made jokes about threesomes and Josh being a man's man are ashamed of themselves.

Brent Schaeffer was going to be suspended for brandishing a weapon. He was already in trouble for grades. He knew he would only fall further behind Ainge in competition for QB and decided to leave of his own accord. Threatening someone with a weapon is worse than getting drunk IMO.

Posted by nnease15 on November 6, 2007 at 2:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Josh McNeil is an idiot. I really started to dislike him after the Georgia game when he went on a rant saying, "I'm tired of the media writing bad things about our football team. Maybe they'll write some good things now." Well, you know what Josh, if you guys would play better on a consistent basis, the media and your fans (such as myself) would quit writing and saying negative things about your football team and coach. He needs to grow up and this latest incident proves it.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 2:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

tngeoff-
What would you suggest Mr. McNeil should have done when he discovered he was locked out of his residence? Unless that THINK card has the phone # for a locksmith on it I fail to see the relevance here.
The quote you posted specifically refers to arrests.

As for being uncooperative with the police, he had done nothing wrong and did not owe them any explanation for his actions. In case you're unaware, the police exist to protect the citizenry as a whole, not to hold hands and find out why someone was locked out of his residence.

Posted by Hoss44 on November 6, 2007 at 2:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This is nothing, why is the media trying to make this into such a big deal. Leave the kid alone.

Posted by erwmy on November 6, 2007 at 2:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I have just located a copy of the team rulebook, and it appears JM did in fact break a rule. Chapter 11, Paragraph 3, Section A, clauses 1, 3, and 7 read as follows...

"...Any varsity member of University of Tennessee athletics teams discovered to have vandalized his own property while the company of less than two female companions will be disciplined for lack of effort, and be forced to miss pre-game warm ups, UNLESS it can be proven by birth records that at least one of the females has the last name of Spurrier, Saban, or Richt, in which case player will be named captain for the following game..."

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

cjraney,

Just out of curiosity...have you ever been locked out of your house, or car? If so...did you pick up a plant and smash the window out at 1:30am to get in? I'm just curious. It doesn't seem like a reasonable solution to me. In fact, it could be construed as an act of "rage", wouldn't you agree? It sure wasn't, "I just wanted to get in because I didn't have my key AT 1:30 am!"

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 2:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

IMO, Mr. McNeil was not only justified in refusing to cooperate with the police, it was also his best option at that time. I would bet that although he knew he had done nothing wrong and simply wanted to get inside his place, he realized admitting any type of action whatsoever could be enough to get him hauled downtown. It would simply depend on the officers involved. If that had happened then there would truly be an "incident" to talk about here and he would likely not be playing on Sat. That would seem to be a harsh consequence for finding oneself locked out of the house.

Posted by sandboxpup on November 6, 2007 at 2:35 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Geoff -

I don't have a THINK card, so maybe this doesn't qualify me to have an opinion...but, if the police break in to my house and put me in handcuffs on my own bed, I probably won't be cooperative, either. Give it a rest, man. If being "uncooperative" means he doesn't answer all of their questions, good for him. That means that he is aware of the Bill of Rights...a fact that, ironically, speaks to the fine level of higher education at the University of Tennessee.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:35 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The the police heard "yelling". Hmmm...another symptom of rage.

"Police cleared the apartment with the exception of a locked bedroom, DeBusk said. No one responded to officers' knocks on the bedroom door or demands to open the door."

"Nobody responded"

The University obviously had gotten involved at that point:

"At that time, DeBusk said, UT Director of High School Relations Gerald Harrison appeared at the scene (1:00am). DeBusk said Harrison, "in a normal speaking voice" asked that the bedroom door be opened and it was."

Posted by bigbluevol on November 6, 2007 at 2:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

tngeoff, please retire the reference to the 2005 article along with the Majors expose. The guy didn't handle the situation well. He made a mistake in the way he handled the police, but people tend to get defensive around police whether they are guilty or not. Think about the last time you were pulled over for speeding. Were you completely polite or a little ticked off and argumentative? That doesn't excuse his behavior, but might explain his actions. I just hope he's gotten that window fixed. We don't need more firearms on the streets.

Posted by Ironcity on November 6, 2007 at 2:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

If having a girl friend sleep at your apartment is wrong then I don't want to be right. How odd that she would actually have friends visit her from another school. Some of you people kill me with your attitudes. You will do or say anything to find something to ride Fulmer about. Give it break. Go watch UT and try to enjoy the games. I am not happy with a lot of whats going on but I don't blame every problem with every player on the coach.

Posted by Colliervol on November 6, 2007 at 2:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Lazhill, spare us the racism BS. I doubt seriously if you know how many chances Shaeffer was given with respect to class attendance and other team issues. The golf club incident only sent it over the top. He may very well have been given 10 chances to correct his attendance and attitude issues and nobody would know but him and the coaches. Evidently, it did no good because he has proceeded to have the same problems at Ole Miss. And he was beaten out by something called a Seth Adams (walk on) at the worst program in the SEC. That should tell you something. Why anybody would want him instead of Ainge is beyond me.

Agree with cjraney. Was there anything illegal in what he did? Was he arrested and charged? Was he in the parking lot shooting his guns? No? Then anything else is much ado about nothing and basically folks wanting to pick at anything involving the football program. (Heck, I crawled in and out of a few first floor dorm windows myself and didn't think a thing about it. And most of that was to see ONE girl, much less three. Now THAT has the makings of a legend.) I'm all for punishment and not much patience on illegal acts. But this is a waste of time.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)

bigbluevol,

You make good points and I will.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 2:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

tngeoff-
What would you suggest? Sleep on the sidewalk? I bet that is enough to be cited for.
Maybe he should have called a locksmith? Think they're open? If so, I'd hate to see the "convenience fee" for a 1.30am call.
Maybe he should've asked Fulmer if he could sleep over in Maryville?
I don't know what planet you live on, but if I was locked out at 1.30am and only a window separated me from my bed then you can bet some glass is gonna get broken.
Is that just my "rage" talking?

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 2:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

cjraney,

Thanks, but I'm done talking about it.

Posted by Colliervol on November 6, 2007 at 2:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Editorial opinion: From what I recall of my college days, if I had been Josh's size and had 3 women trying to get into my apartment, they wouldn't have had to worry about a flower pot through the window. The door would have been off its hinges.

Posted by drmike on November 6, 2007 at 2:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)

i'm married now but i do remember 2 threesomes at UT, actually one in ayres hall----those were the days--go josh

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 2:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

cjraney, what I was doing was not rolling with liberal BS. And also, if you go back and look at all of my posts there isn't one time that I pass judgement on anyone.

You on the other hand have made it a point to reflect sarcasm towards me in multiple posts. I appreciate you also letting me know that you are educated with a doctorate degree and made mistakes like the rest of us. I also hold a post grad degree and have gone through difficult times.

I believe you have missed my point completely and to date have not responded to my question. How many chances should coker have received? Pretty simple question. You made comments to me that "its a good thing you weren't LaMarcus parents". I can tell you this, if I was he sure wouldn't have needed 4+ chances to realize what was important in life.

Posted by invisiblekid on November 6, 2007 at 3:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree that this isn't the type of behavior we want to see from our student-athletes but this isn't even a blip on the radar compared to some incidents at other schools.

http://www.reuters.com/article/domest...

http://www.azcentral.com/community/te...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/st...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/st...

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colleg...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/st...

Not condoning the actions of McNeil, simply trying to offer some perspective fellas.

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 3:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

tngeoff has made some good points with some good arguments. He has also asked some questions that should have been raised such as to the character of this team (and all teams/students) in America. If more people would fo that, we probably wouldn't have to be talking about why people should or should not be worried about talking to police.

Jraney, you have raised a lot of rebuttle questions, but what about providing some answers? You have made a lot of "what if" comments, but can you provide some insight as to what should have happened in certain situations. Rules are standards across the board. Although there are situational circumstances that should always be taken into account, rules are in place across the board...not just for some folks some of the time.

"I would bet that although he knew he had done nothing wrong and simply wanted to get inside his place, he realized admitting any type of action whatsoever could be enough to get him hauled downtown." Are you kidding? Why would anyone be concerned about cooperating with authorities of any kind if they knew they had done nothing wrong?

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 3:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc-ash,
1. I said it's a good thing you're not one of my parents.

2. TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION: I think Mr. Coker should've gotten however many chances are outlined by the university, coach, SEC, and NCAA for his specific offenses. Those are the people in charge of his behavior as it pertains to college athletics. All of those folks get paid to make those decisions so I will give them the benefit of the doubt and say they are more qualified than you and I to do so.

3. How many chances would Mr. Coker have needed if you were his parent? What would've been the appropriate consequences?

4. You say you, too, have made some mistakes. Excuse me, "gone through difficult times." How many "chances" did you get and do you feel it was enough, too many, or not enough?

5. Finally, marc-ash, if you've got a problem with sarcasm then this forum might not be the place for you.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 3:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash,

Good points. Good post.

Posted by BigManVolFan on November 6, 2007 at 3:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

lets all just be glad that McNeil wasnt shot with a taser gun by the Taser Badge Police!!

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 3:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

geoff, If the police bust into my house in the middle of the night yelling and screaming, handcuff me, and start asking a bunch of confusing questions... I probably won't say anything either.

"wouldn't cooperate" may equal "wouldn't tell us things we wanted to hear."

After his last problem, he was probably told to do and say nothing until he talked to someone in the Ath Dept.

Posted by cjraney on November 6, 2007 at 3:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Marc-ash,
Your last statement illustrates how little you know about how local law enforcement works.

As far as me providing you with some answers, I don't know much about you so I'll probably be of little help.

But as for "rules and standards across the board," IMO that is the jurisdiction of the coach, university, conference, and NCAA. We, as fans, can squawk all we want to about "what we would do in X situation" but it's still just a bunch of squawking.

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 3:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

sjt18,

Good points. Especially the last one. That I believe for sure, and that would explain:

"At that time, DeBusk said, UT Director of High School Relations Gerald Harrison appeared at the scene (1:00am). DeBusk said Harrison, "in a normal speaking voice" asked that the bedroom door be opened and it was."

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 3:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"I don't know about you, but it really isn't that smart to just have several guns laying around unsecured."

VolCR, McNeil is a country boy who likes to hunt. I live in a very rural community and can virtually guarantee that 90% of the houses here have rifles and shotguns in closets, corners, bedrooms, etc with ammunition. Folks out here just don't think in terms of being an opportunity for a criminal... since we don't have the crime that the sophisticated urban folks have.

Posted by sjt18 on November 6, 2007 at 3:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BTW, Coker did get too many chances but they did follow policy.

Maybe all this energy wouldn't be wasted if folks started writing MH demanding more strict standards? OTOH, how much "unlike" the student population do we want these guys to be? BYU can probably get away with that kind of restriction but can UT?

Posted by tngeoff on November 6, 2007 at 3:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

cjraney,

Did you go to Georgia Tech?

Posted by marc_ash on November 6, 2007 at 3:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

cjrany, I have no problem with sarcasm. If you want some, I'm sure I can muster some up. But at the expense of potentially uttering some "liberal BS" I will keep quiet.

At the expense of sounding like Hillary Clinton when asked what she thought of ID's for illegal immigrants let me actually do something you have failed to do in any of yoru posts cjraney, which is actually answer a question.

1. I said it's a good thing you're not one of my parents. **Probably is a good thing. Because I would have given you a chance and probably 2. Then I would have let what happened to you happen...and that is allow you the opportunity to fail out of school, go to JR college and figure it out on your own (like it sounds like you eventually did).**

2. TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION: I think Mr. Coker should've gotten however many chances are outlined by the university, coach, SEC, and NCAA for his specific offenses. Those are the people in charge of his behavior as it pertains to college athletics. All of those folks get paid to make those decisions so I will give them the benefit of the doubt and say they are more qualified than you and I to do so. **Right, and that has worked out very well for Mr. Coker hasn't it? 4 failed drug screens and facing dropping out of school. Love how you are so quick to give the "powers that be" authority over every situation. While we are at it, why don't we let our HS school system make all of the decisions for our kids too. Like you said, they get paid to make